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Poster: fireeagle Date: Dec 2, 2009 2:36pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: novice here

been burning all my audio cds from 44.1 wavs (default), but thinking lately about switching 2 48.000(?)

44.1 = 1411kbps (1min = cca 10mb, 80min cd = cca 800mb)
48.000 = 1576kbps (1min = cca 11mb, 80min cd = cca 880mb)

now my question is: how the fuck r 800mb (80 min) of files squeezed on 7oomb discs (all error free and sounding great)? what exactly does nero do 2 the the wavs i feed it w/? converts them 2 something else during burning process or what?

condensed answer if possible. thx

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Poster: NoiseCollector Date: Dec 2, 2009 4:49pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: novice here

Oh and to answer the question about how 800 megs fits on a 700mb CD, it can't, hence the limitation of 80 minutes at 16bit, 44.1k.

Redbook standard (the audio CD standard format) dictates that audio must be 16bit, 44.1k to burn to AUDIO CD but you could load a CD-ROM with 48k or 96k WAV files for playback on a CD-ROM drive.

When you convert sample rates between numbers indivisible by themselves, or oddly divisble, you get quantizing and experts suggest dithering... a whole bunch of mysterious mumbo jumbo you probably will want to avoid hearing about but to some it up:

If you convert a 44.1k file to 22.5k or 88.2, you either cut out half the digital snippets of sound to create the smaller file, or duplicate half the cycles to create the larger file. Either way, no artificial data or noise is introduced. What happens when you start converting from 48k to 44.1 or from 44.1 to 32k is that you create odd divisions of those snippets and introduce aliasing, or noise to the signal.

Experts recomend "dithering" when "bouncing down" to lower bit rates that do not divide evenly into 2. The dither process creates low level noise and masks those odd bits and bytes of date, creating the illusion of a smoother and more organic sound... it's all a bunch of gobbledey goop..

I have been digitizing sound for over 20 years when digital was a joke comarted to a cheap Kmart cassette. I can tell you that for a grown adult that has been to concerts, worked contruction, visited gun ranges and played bass through a 400 watt biamped 6 foot amp for years standing next to a drummer and a marshal stack, that those frequencies you seek to gain by turning up the sampling rate are a fantasy and mostly for bragging rights by rich gear sluts.

The only advantage I have found in higher bit rates that might be feasable for consideration would be using 32 bit wavs for audio mastering because apparently you gain more headroom and the signal does not "clip" (become distorted and pop) when it redlines. Again, this applies to running multitrack recording software and mixing tracks with digital reverbs and stuff where the more data in means better signal out... again to burn a CD, you mix down to 16bit 44.1k anyway so do you really gain anything?

The verdict is still out.

I can tell you that CD's will be obsolete in the next 10 years though so none of this will matter.

As storage and data transfer speeds increase, the need for lasers and million mile an hour plastic dics spinning at a precise speed seem pointless when you can plug an $8 2 GIGABYTE card from walmart into your PC and listen to 2 and a half CD's of music without a laser beam and high rpm motor.

The only good thing about that will be the death of mp3... there will be no need for flac or ogg or any other compression either, it will be full speed ahead... but the limits of the human ear will take millions of years to catch up to the increased fidelity.

Sorry this is not condensed but the summary is:

If you are converting cassette recordings or even DAT tape or anything else from the past to digital, you won't gain any quality or increased frequency than what is already there.

The main thing is the quality of the analog to digital conversion rate and the amount of connections and generations in between the source and your speakers.

If you are burning an old concert recorded on a tape... you will get what you got, it will just last longer and not wear out as fast (and it's easier to copy).

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Poster: NoiseCollector Date: Dec 2, 2009 3:38pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: novice here

CD's cannot handle more than 44.1k....

DVD's are 48khz...

Nyquist theory states that the maximum fequency captured by digital audio device is half the maximum frequency so CD's can reproduce up to 22.5khz or 22,500 cycles per second... my ears cannot hear anything above 15k anymore and newborn ears only go to 18-20khz max...

Only when mastering audio do percieved benefits arguably occur from using higher rates... but for burning CD's (audio redbook standard anyway) 44.1k is max rate... I cannot here any difference between 16bit 44.1k and 24 bit 96k...